Comments on: the english cut wars (cont.)

By: David Moles

David Moles — Thu, 09 Jun 2005 01:02:05 +0000

Damn straight. I’m not at the point now where I can honestly convince myself that it makes sense to spend $3000-$5000 on a suit instead of on something else, but between now and when I get there, I still have to wear SOMETHING.
And if there was a brand like, say, English Cut, that I could trust to be the best available for the money — that I could trust, frankly not to suck — I’d be all over that.

By: hugh macleod

hugh macleod — Wed, 08 Jun 2005 19:20:48 +0000

Ah! Gordon, you identified the flaw in the “don’t do it” argument.
I have never once referred to suits as “luxury” items. A suit is a suit is a suit. You wear them, for the same reason you wear anything else– to cover up one’s nakedness, to protect oneself from the elements, and to identify yourself among your group.
Yeah, bespoke suits are by far the best route, in terms of actual product quality. But they cost a lot of money and take weeks to make. So time and money are the big opportunity costs– for both supplier and customer.
So, let’s say you don’t have a lot of time or money. What compromises are you willing to make, as a customer? And what compromises is English Cut willing to make, as a supplier?
At least with English Cut, you and I can hopefully have an informed, two-way conversation about this (like you are doing now bwah ha ha ha…). Try doing that with Armani.

By: Gordon

Gordon — Tue, 07 Jun 2005 18:51:26 +0000

If I have read this post correctly, you are asking if it is possible to advertise a luxury product and, on sensing that a customer can’t quite afford the luxury offering, proceed to offer him something that is more “in his price range” (i.e. cheaper).
I’d say forget it.
The old hands have got it right: Get the punters in the door with a reasonable offering and talk to the man and show him that he CAN have it or an even better one (as opposed to reminding him that he can’t afford it).
Selling what was originally offered or “up” not only massages the customer’s ego, he will leave the store feeling good about himself.
What do you think?

By: Lee Bryant

Lee Bryant — Mon, 06 Jun 2005 18:11:56 +0000

Hmmm … fair point I suppose. I just find it hard to square your current story (off the peg can be cool) with the original one (bespoke is the one true way).
Anyway, all credit to you for hosting the debate

By: hugh macleod

hugh macleod — Mon, 06 Jun 2005 04:13:09 +0000

Lee I’m not sure if I agree with the Ferrari anology…
Why? 10 years ago a Porshe SUV would have been unthinkable. Now I see them in Knightsbridge all the time.
I’m enjoying this debate, I have to say…

By: hugh macleod

hugh macleod — Mon, 06 Jun 2005 03:39:22 +0000

Excellent point, Cubicle… and now you know why Armani has “White Label” and “Black Label”… people need the little boxes etc.

By: Lee Bryant

Lee Bryant — Mon, 06 Jun 2005 03:22:45 +0000

What a kerfuffle! FWIW I think some of the commenters are right — esp. the one about Ferrari doing an MPV — and you are in danger of contradicting yourself here. See you in .dk!

By: Cubicle Coder

Cubicle Coder — Mon, 06 Jun 2005 03:08:17 +0000

FWIW, I think the comment storm isn't about the suits. As a geek, I don't give a shit about suits right now and I've done the best I can all my life trying to avoid them. I expect a lot of others feel that way. But - geeks are facinated by "The Best" IMO. Best CPU, best OS, best graphics card ad nauseum. The English Cut was portrayed as "The Best" suits, and that caught my imagination even though I don't care about suits! Top of the line shit always seems to do this to me. Now the English Cut is talking about suits that aren't "The Best." That makes people mad. Wasn't it cool because it was The Best? Hugh, I think you and Tom are now talking about the best - as in, the best at a particular price point. That makes perfect sense, logically. But geeks aren't logical about "The Best" - its like the Holy of Holies. We want "The Best" - period! - Caveats like "at a price point" don't cut it. Of course, as a cubicle coder I don't really know what I'm talking about when it comes to marketing (BTW, your blog is great for me - kind of a "Marketing Eye for the Engineering Guy"). But it seems like for geeks (if you give a shit) you've got to twist the story around so that you're still "The Best." The ipod shuffle campaign was masterful, in that it made the shuffle "The Best" to geeks for what it was - a really small, lightweight MP3 player that you could look sorta cool wearing - GeeK Jewlery someone said. Maybe you can make these new suits "The Best" in some other way? Anyway - good luck!

By: John Corrigan

John Corrigan — Sun, 05 Jun 2005 23:35:04 +0000

I think you have a really good story here. English cut is providing a bit of education about suits. I have learned a lot about what makes a good suit form the blog and . The ready to wear idea, if done well, would allow people to experiment, without the large investment in money and time that bespoke would involve. They could buy a top quality ready to wear suit and, if they liked it, then graduate to bespoke, knowing they will like the style. An upgrade path is provided, to borrow IT terminology. I think it would be a winner.

By: Rich...!

Rich...! — Sun, 05 Jun 2005 22:32:00 +0000

But this is not about suits, I thought you got that…!